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shaggy

So what is the deal with phylos these days?

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shaggy

Just looking for a update to what this company is up to these days.

Anyone?


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greendiamond9

They are pissing off a lot of people.

 

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imiubu

Yep.  Man, my mind just screamed "danger, danger Will Robinson".  Figured they'd steal dna and it looks as though they do.

Fair credit and compensation??? Fug em.  IMO it was all a scam to get genetics under the guise of cataloguing for knowledge.


 

 

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Tynehead Tom

wolves in sheeps clothing..... that's how I see it.

It's not open source information either. A great many people have submitted genetics that do not show in the galaxy because if you pay phylos, you can have your results kept private.

So there is part of the galaxy that no one ever gets to see..... making the whole thing kind of pointless and incomplete as far as using it as a dna knowledge base.

I really lost interest in anything phylos was doing when I saw the test results for Doc Gage's Sar Hawza. I don't believe the information at all and believe phylos gives results that are skewed for thier own agenda. The "skunk, berry and og kush" categories are laughable as well.

The whole thing is a scam leading up to what we are seeing now.

 

better learn how to tissue culture boys n girls..... it is the future of plant propagation.

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Coastal

Yeah I read the comments on that ig post yesterday.. was at 114 or so and people are pissed indeed!

 

see they edited it now but that’s a long shot off their stance if we will never start a seed or genetics business they where spouting a few months back when it was discovered they could take tissue from dead dried plant matter and and remake it.., that was how they had convinced people it was safe for the first few years... 

 

i myself havent been able to exract any useful information out of their galaxy so I’m not sure the draw but I’m glad I never did. Whatever though if it was that easy the industry would have been taken over much faster.. I doubt they could do anything that exciting with the same genetics most people have already.

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shaggy

Old 11-18-2014, 11:48 PM#1

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CANNABIS DNA PROJECT

Cannabis Colleagues,

Greetings from the International Hemp Association in Amsterdam. We are writing to tell you about an exciting research program using modern DNA analysis to build a family tree for Cannabis, and to request your participation. 

We are collaborating with a US-based group working on a definitive large-scale phylogenetic study of the evolution of Cannabis. Key researchers include Mowgli Holmes, the chief scientific officer at Phylos Bioscience, Rob DeSalle, a professor of evolutionary biology at Columbia University and curator at the American Museum of Natural History.

Presently, the team is building a high-resolution map of the Cannabis genome, based on a modern hybrid THC/CBD strain, using PacBio long-read Next-Gen Sequencing (NGS). The map will serve as a reference key for analysis of thousands of other accessions using an SNP (Single Nucleotide Polymorphism) NGS protocol called GBS (Genotyping By Sequencing) allowing high-resolution characterization of each accession. 

So far, the group has sequenced over 400 drug-type Cannabis samples. DNA extraction equipment is installed in nine Cannabis testing labs in six US states, and we continue to gather modern hybrid drug varieties. In the next month the group will finish collecting and sequencing our first 1000 samples. In order to collect data from ancient seeds the group is modifying protocols used for sequencing fragmented Pleistocene DNA samples, developing protocols to work with single seeds, and adding a Whole Genome Amplification step to increase DNA yield.

In two or three months we hope to have a provisional relationship map worked out that we can put on the web and will let us ID modern strains and hopefully at least test theories concerning the evolution of Cannabis. 

Within six months we will analyze additional modern cultivars plus traditional landraces and possibly herbarium sheets and archeological materials. From there on we will add to the live database which will continue to grow as more samples are received although the architecture should not change. Genome data will be studied via network theory to address the issues of hybridization and reticulation in the phylogeny.

Cannabis is an incredibly varied genus made up of a myriad of local landrace varieties and modern cultivars as well as their feral and wild relatives. This research will generate a huge amount of sequence data and unique SNPs spread over many thousands of samples, and we feel confident we can resolve the evolution of Cannabis under domestication.

To further our study and create as complete an evolutionary tree as possible we need seeds collected overseas (or reproduced domestically) and have not been interbred with modern drug hybrids. We are interested in ALL Cannabis whether grown for fiber, seed or drug production as well as feral and wild populations. We can now collect sufficient high-quality DNA for analysis from a single seed. And there is no requirement to grow the seeds, so we can also use dead seeds. Many conscious travelers, marijuana users and growers collected seeds that they never got around to sowing, and now years later they are dead. Dead seeds are useless to growers and breeders, but they still contain valuable genetic information that can provide us with deeper insights into Cannabis’s evolution. It is also legal for us to send dead non-viable seeds to our lab in the USA by post.

If you have any seeds you feel may be of interest (living or dead) and want to contribute to this fascinating research feel free to contact us, just PM SamS at IC. We will provide a Netherlands PO Box for you to send the seed samples to us and we will provide an optional questionnaire about each batch of seeds. Batches can range from just a single to 25+ seeds. 

As research progresses we will share data with you about any accessions you provide. Upon completion the results will change how we all look at Cannabis, and we will better understand the heritage of modern Cannabis cultivars. Growers will be able to see how their varieties (as well as traditional landraces sent by contributors) fit into the big picture – to determine the landrace origins of modern hybrids (ex., Jamaican, Mexican, Colombian, etc.) and explore deeper evolutionary relationships. Fascinating, eh?
If you have any questions please feel free to contact us.

All the best,

Rob Clarke and Sam Skunkman



Many people have asked us questions about our projects. The questions below are the ones we hear again and again. We want our work to be good for everyone involved, and we intend to be transparent about how and why we’re doing it.


PHYLOS BIOSCIENCE DNA PROJECT FAQ

Why is Phylos sequencing the DNA of all these Cannabis strains?

A few reasons. First we have some scientific questions we just want answered. We want to know how Cannabis has evolved, what its history was like, and how it has co-evolved with humans. And we want to know what domestication does to the shape of evolution.

We also want to understand today’s crazy mix of hybrid strains. We want to know where they came from, why they’re so different, and what makes each one unique.

But the reason that will probably affect most people is that we want to change the Cannabis industry into a modern, legitimate marketplace, where people actually know what they’re getting. We think this is the only way. 


Will Phylos make and sell genetically modified Cannabis?

No. Absolutely not. 


Will someone else make and sell genetically modified Cannabis?

Maybe. But it won’t be us. And it won’t make much sense to do it, because it is so easy to create amazing strains of Cannabis using traditional breeding techniques.


Will Phylos patent the strains that are submitted? Doesn’t sequencing the DNA of something let you control it or patent it?

We won’t patent the strains that are submitted. We don’t want to, and we couldn’t. Here are a few important facts about patents and plants:

* Sequencing the DNA of something does NOT let you patent it. In fact, after the court cases <https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/12pdf/12-398_1b7d.pdf>Assoc. for Molecular Pathology v. Myriad Genetics and <https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/11pdf/10-1150.pdf>Mayo Collaborative Services v. Prometheus Laboratories, Inc., it is no longer possible to patent naturally occurring DNA sequences at all.

* Cannabis strains cannot be patented, at least not now. To apply for a plant patent you have to declare that you successfully grew your new Cannabis variety somewhere on U.S. soil. The patent office will not grant claims that rest on violations of federal law.

* Intellectual property protection over a plant variety can also be obtained through the USDA Plant Variety Protection Office. But only for plants on their official list. Cannabis is not on that list, and won’t be until it is federally legal.

* Only things that are NEW can be patented. Once something is public and known about, it’s too late. Once something has been sold commercially, it’s too late. Even if Cannabis strains could be patented, all the existing strains are now in the public domain, and will stay there forever. Which is a good thing.


But doesn’t Monsanto want to patent all the Cannabis strains in the world and then make it illegal for me to grow any of them?

Probably. But existing strains can’t be patented.



What will Phylos do with the information it collects from sequencing the DNA of different Cannabis varieties?

We will use it to construct a map of all the different strains. We will publish this and make the data freely available to the research community. The individual data from each sample will also be freely available to the person who submitted it.

Last edited by Sam_Skunkman; 12-13-2014 at 01:09 AM..

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shaggy

 

That thread is all gone now.

I noticed not one of my posts is left and i was very polite.

But in a nutshell I was preachin they gonna steal your shit guys

sam the skunkman waved his wand and poof it all goes away.

notice this post was made by ninja but edited by skunkface...LOL

11-20-2014, 07:26 PM #20
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Sam Skunkman, when you say Rob Clark, do you mean Robert Connell Clark??

Yes.
-SamS

Last edited by Sam_Skunkman; 11-20-2014 at 08:34 PM..

 

I find this post proof enough, for me anyhow.

Anybody remember skunkface saying he would pay for all of the tests sent in himself and you could just send them to him?

WTF, right!

 

 12-08-2014, 07:02 PM #70
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My more limited goal is to try and obtain all of the landraces in the world, drug, hemp or wild. I have figured there are maybe 20,000 worldwide? Anyway I sure can try!
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Tynehead Tom
38 minutes ago, Coastal said:

Yeah I read the comments on that ig post yesterday.. was at 114 or so and people are pissed indeed!

 

see they edited it now but that’s a long shot off their stance if we will never start a seed or genetics business they where spouting a few months back when it was discovered they could take tissue from dead dried plant matter and and remake it.., that was how they had convinced people it was safe for the first few years... 

 

i myself havent been able to exract any useful information out of their galaxy so I’m not sure the draw but I’m glad I never did. Whatever though if it was that easy the industry would have been taken over much faster.. I doubt they could do anything that exciting with the same genetics most people have already.

 

yup and I've seen sam skunkman openly post on icmag that reviving dead tissue was not possible..... while at the same time I'm reading the studies that say they absolutely can and are. By "they" I don't necessarily refer to phylos..... but we all know that if the science is there.... they are going to use it along side all the other tools.

 

in the end though, there are millions of hobby weed growers and a good percentage of them save and make seeds or have good libraries from seedbank purchases, gifts from friends ect. It will take decades to flush the "illicit" seeds from the millions of growers if they ever can actually eradicate community held seed stock. We simply will over grow these mutherfuckers too.

How we keep genetic libraries has to change though. This whole idea of mother plants and clone rooms and all the media and lighting and on and on...... this is now the "old way" of doing things. We have to collectively step up our game and add small sanitary work rooms to our grows with tissue culture replacing traditional mother plant and cloning operations.

I registered for a tissue culture technician course so hope to be a bloody expert in a few months LOL online and the accredited introductory course is only 400bucks+tax  so not so bad. Once I'm a "bloody expert" (haha) , I think perhaps a couple buried sea cans with environment controls and we can soon make our own super bank for all the community clone only cuts we can gather. Out of the hands of anyone tied to corporate cannabis but availlable to those with good intentions. fuck phylos LOL

 

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shaggy

 

I wonder if I can get myself banned over there.

Gonna give it a shot.:smoking-a-joint-smiley-emoticon:

 

Just now...LOL

04-17-2019, 04:33 PM #1
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So what is the deal with phylos these days?

The word on the street is that they stole every submitted sample and are now making bank off of all the DNA that was sent in.

Is this true?
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imiubu
1 hour ago, shaggyballs said:

Old 11-18-2014, 11:48 PM#1

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CANNABIS DNA PROJECT

Cannabis Colleagues,

Greetings from the International Hemp Association in Amsterdam. We are writing to tell you about an exciting research program using modern DNA analysis to build a family tree for Cannabis, and to request your participation. 

We are collaborating with a US-based group working on a definitive large-scale phylogenetic study of the evolution of Cannabis. Key researchers include Mowgli Holmes, the chief scientific officer at Phylos Bioscience, Rob DeSalle, a professor of evolutionary biology at Columbia University and curator at the American Museum of Natural History.

Yep, this is the first I read of this project and it had my spidey senses on high alert 😮

 

@Tynehead Tom I hope the class is worth the ducks.  Please let us know.  I think you are correct and any of us who are interested in keeping our

genetics need to bone up on tissue culture.  Best of luck with the class.


 

 

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Tynehead Tom

they still need 11 people to register by may1st or it gets bumped to next term but I'm registered so will get my learnin on soon enuff hehehe

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shaggy

This should get under the skunkface's skin a bit.

Like a tick I seem to like it there...LOL

 

 

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Wow so all the talk is true then...huh?

Didn't Sam the skunkman asure us this sort of thing could not happen?
I am pretty sure I asked him this question directly and he said it could not happen.
I would quote it but I can not seem to find the post.
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Kingfish

Half Gram / Rat Man Sam and Phylos. Hmm.. Sounds extremely trustworthy doesn’t it??

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shaggy

https://conceptionnurseries.com/technology/

 

Unrivaled Plant Genetics

Conception has assembled the finest collection of germplasm (existing plant varieties) in the world. We also have access to the largest database of cannabis genomics in the world.

Yea, they now own  everything in the phylos galaxy.🤨

I am not the only one but I did my best to warn against supporting these guys.


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xxPeacePipexx

" The next generation of transformative" This is something that was obvious from the beginning of this companies debut. But I do recall scam the bunk man asking for everyone to send all of the seeds they had from the past for a genetic research program. That rat has one too many faces and names.

 

 

Death science does not serve anything other than the almighty dollar.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


Star plants have a universal signature ...

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Coastal

I definitely saw high probability of this happening, but I’ve been holding/sharing cuts for 25 years so I know exactly how people’s minds change when they all of a sudden realize they could make financial gains... promises soon forgotten.. 

 

i dont know the guy, but I know people who do.. personally.. and ex associates from pre Amsterdam days, and none of them think Dave Watson is behind any “evil plan” or an informer.., honestly the guy brought a lot, has been stole from and had more of lines he collected bred with than anyone else I can think of... maybe I’m wrong but I’m sure a lot more truth will come out some day... 

 

i definately dont trust all the new “business” people.. and the fact these same guys have a separate tissue lab all of a sudden.. hmmm 2+2 doesn’t equal 6... the crazy part is that shit bags like this are leveraging “our” communities property to suits who will make the majority of the money for only 3.5mil! Crazy! That’s not even that much and then they get an evaluation and boom goes public at 10x the value... 

 

good time to be a suit and know about starting companies because all the growers end up with fuck all.

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Stewart169

Fascinating topic that I haven’t paid much if any attention to. What’s the end game for them ?? Even if they have all these genetics by hook or crook do they expect to drive all old school breeders and pollen chuckers out of existence some how? Or do they plan on stealing the next gorilla glue and patent it to make it illegal to possess those genes?

I suppose they could pick any breeders best strains, patent the genetics and then sue the original breeders for infringement for even possessing the plants and sue for using them in future breeding programs by the original breeders for seed sales. 

Or is there more I’m not seeing.  I’m just not wired to be an unethical scumbag so I can’t think the way they do. Which also means I’d have made a poor lawyer. 

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Tynehead Tom

From my seat, if some of the naysayers are correct,  I would not call it fear I would call it community betrayal. At least from my perspective.

I used to follow the work of robert clark like he was a globe trotting cannabis god....... on the flip side, I never even gave sam skunkman a second thought. That name never came up in our circles back in the day and as far as I've been told the  BC skunk cut came from a grow in cultus lake b.c. less than a mile from the US border. No idea if it was "sam skunkman seeds" or not.... like i say, the name never came up. (late 80's when skunk was all the rage thru to 2005 when i took my hiatus).

Back then, early 2000's names like Bros Grimm, Chimera , Jordan of the Islands, these guys were "just" emerging onto the seed market (marc emory catalog)

 

anyhow, back on topic..... These people who created phylos and other organizations did stick thier necks out in a near global illegal market and are indeed pioneers of the community and thru thier education and experience, pioneers of legal cannabis. Do they deserve to make money to retire on and support thier families? i think from all the years of toiling under the thumb of the law, spending 10's of thousands on education into the plant sciences and being bold enough to bring thier work in front of thier peers? I have to answer that question with a yes.

Where I have a problem with these guys is that instead of these guys remaining loyal to the community , they seem to be working towards some things that would have a very detrimental effect on the "freedom of cannabis".

Cornering the market maybe.

 

The mass tissue culture clone production facilities are a game changer for people with massive libraries of genetics, no matter how they aquired them.

If I could walk into a nursery and purchase an elite clone only, disease free and with loads of vigor , that would be nice I suppose

However, it seems that the people in the game such as the one phylos is playing, is geared towards creating a master system that along with tissue culture, will be manipulating the plants potency, flavor, ect ect ect and adding gentic markers to identify it from black market or "free" cannabis.

 

We only need to look at what was regulated regarding food crops ...... Corn is a very good example of how the government and agricultural corporations have eradicated a once thriving and very diverse corn farming past time. Now if you want to sell your corn for human consumption the seeds must be of certain type by regulation.... same with growing corn for animal feed... rules and regulations apply.

Corn , along with wheat, tomatoes, and i could go on for a while listing all the food crops where typical farmer uses his plants to make seed and hobby breed new and interesting hybrids ..... all that is a thing of the past.

I would have hoped that folks like those involved with phylos and some of the south american growing operations would have put thier expertise towards preventing this type of thing happening to Cannabis globally but from my seat it appears that they are rocketting forward to do to cannabis, what was done to corn.

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gorilla ganja

Well said @Tynehead Tom  - having rights to protect your seed is nothing new. Just new to cannabis because it was illegal for so long. 

Does this stop the back yard farmer from producing there own seed for corn. No, just stops them from selling it for mass production to farmers.

If they go through the red tape they can probably get their seed certified and sell it on a mass scale. But of course all this takes time and money most backyard breeders don't want to spend.

 

back to the  topic of Phylos 

 

Stated on their site, if anyone wants to actually read what they are about.

https://phylos.bio/

 

 

Data Ownership

Every customer retains FULL OWNERSHIP AND OWNERSHIP RIGHTS in the samples they submit, including:
• The genetic data generated from the tests;
• The plants and any plant matter submitted; and
• Any current or future rights in plant protection of the varieties.

 

They also state in the announcement of their breeding program that they are getting genetics from Oregon.

 

"We are excited to announce our plant breeding program launching in spring 2019. EDIT: We believe breeders should always get fair credit and compensation for their work. We’re currently working with long time Oregon breeders to negotiate fair licensing contracts for seeds, clones, and other germplasm that will serve as the foundation for our breeding program."

 

Not by bringing back DNA samples from the dead seeds that were sent in

 

Some really good seed companies and top notch breeders from around the world are working with these guys and are not afraid of having their material being stolen. 

I don't think we have to burn any Witches at the stake just yet. But maybe I'm wrong.

 

Peace GG

 

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shaggy

@gorilla ganja

As you said lets not convict before the evidence is in.

I do not believe they are going for plant patents.

They state on the website they want royalties.

So you would need to pay for use of their genetics every time you use them.

I have been looking hard into protection rights and it is a tough study.

I believe cannabis like pictures ect. will have royalties paid to the owner.

19 minutes ago, gorilla ganja said:

Every customer retains FULL OWNERSHIP AND OWNERSHIP RIGHTS in the samples they submit,

So if I sent them a sample, do I have the right to ask for that sample back as tissue culture?

For a fee of course, I have heard folks are doing backing up and cleaning genetics around the country.

Some real cool shit too.

But they have a contract so they don't get screwed.

21 minutes ago, gorilla ganja said:

Some really good seed companies and top notch breeders from around the world are working with these guys and are not afraid of having their material being stolen. 

Most likely this is true but they are under contract, with terms laid out in advance.

I feel this is much different, unless they offer all of this to the general public...... for a small fee of course, not rape...LOL

Now if they were to offer you any genetics in the galaxy for say $100 per I would call them heroes!

 

1 hour ago, Tynehead Tom said:

I would not call it fear I would call it community betrayal.

I see it this way also.

I ask why all the deception?


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gorilla ganja
13 minutes ago, shaggyballs said:

So if I sent them a sample, do I have the right to ask for that sample back as tissue culture?

For a fee of course, I have heard folks are doing backing up and cleaning genetics around the country.

Some real cool shit too.

 

I don't know the details never sent them anything yet. If you send in a dead seed or tissue sample. They can not bring it back to life and tissue culture it.

There are some companies that specialize in tissue culture and will store genetics and produce tissue samples for you if your legal.

Check out these guys   http://www.segra-intl.com/

 

Like @Tynehead Tom was saying this is the future whether  we want it or not.

 

19 minutes ago, shaggyballs said:

Now if they were to offer you any genetics in the galaxy for say $100 per I would call them heroes!

 

The majority of these they cannot access themselves. Only the data gathered from the DNA. Which is valuable in it self and cost them money to gather and categorize.

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Coastal

@gorilla ganja they figured out how to get useable DNA from the dried samples and seeds etc.. not sure exactly how it works but they put that DNA in a host plant somehow, they can make seeds to with the DNA I heard aswell..

 

that was the big deal ,what 6 8 months ago ?where they reassured everyone that thought they protected themselves by sending non viable samples that although they could use the material it didn’t matter because “we will NEVER start our own genetics project”

 

pretty sure thats about accurate.. people where choked! Not winning friends this phylos...

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Tynehead Tom

In the grand scheme of things, I could give a flying fuck what phylos does. They or anyone like them will never dictate what grows in my garden or what I wrap in my rolling papers and that's the fact of the matter.

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Kingfish
59 minutes ago, Coastal said:

where they reassured everyone that thought they protected themselves by sending non viable samples that although they could use the material it didn’t matter because “we will NEVER start our own genetics project”

 

 

 

Yup, that about sums it up. 

 

“”Thievery Corporation”” Here’s to you!!!

 

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Dog Star

Heh..  taste of Sam Skunkman is started to being bitter for most in community..  am really sorry for all people and for loosed genetics,

to me everything sits on "right" place if we talk about mine thoughts on Sam the Scumman..

 

am already get rich experience when i buyed Ancestral Skunk#1 that he breeds with those genius Rob Clark..

 

Am think they both need to be out of cannabis job for a good of community but people hard to get truths in time...  while there it is..,

voices on Sam wasnt great before so why we expected he will now be a proper lad..??

 

Those Chimpera was holding him "ladder" while they robbed folks on Ancestral Skunk#1..  selling them a ton of hermi seeds..   ;D  LOL

 

 

What a tricksters...  and they are like famous breeders..  tiefs and robbers..

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